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Report 419
Report #419 Skillset: Night Skill: Choke Org: Ur'Guard Status: Rejected Jul 2010 Furies' Decision: We will expect defer covering this until Shuyin's Special Report. Problem: As much as everyone complained about roomwide choke, after months of the alternative, single target choke has proven to be an even greater evil. Single target choke in group combat is akin to playing hot potato with a small nuke: whether it's the caster or the target (more often than not the target, since the caster can decide when's best to choke), someone is going to nigh instantly die as entire groups dogpile someone with extremely limited curing and ability to act. Indeed, I feel the path that was taken with choke was not only a little shortsighted, but also more complicated than it needed to be. 0 R: 0 Solution #1: Solution 1: Make choke roomwide once again, but with some strict limitations: anyone standing in a choked room receives a protection field that blocks demesne effects and loyal entities (fae, angels, demons, etc). Furthermore, if the choker leaves the room he choked, choke will drop in 2-3 seconds unless he returns. 0 R: 0 Solution #2: Same as solution 1 except make ents tick 1.5 times slower and double the time for demesnes Player Comments: ---on 7/12 @ 09:45 writes: ...? I'm not certain if you're entirely serious about this report considering the short-sightedness of the proposition in regards to the wiccan guild. ---on 7/12 @ 11:16 writes: Well... assuming it is a serious report, it would also mean a Shadowdancer can kick the stuffings out of a Druid even easier than they currently can with Brumetower. What would a druid have without a demesne or trees(sap)? A simpler solution along these lines would be to have choke be a room effect again, but like Octave instead of old roomchoke - making it affect everyone in the room equally, but cancel instantly upon caster movement? ---on 7/12 @ 13:27 writes: To clarify my comment above, I'm not saying that roomchoke is a good idea, but that the solution currently proposed could do with some refining. ---on 7/12 @ 18:42 writes: I too would like a return to room-wide choke sans the ability to use it in Supermob rooms. I don't see a need for there to be any other limit outside of that, since most room-wide effects hit on a 10 second cycle anyhow. ---on 7/12 @ 20:57 writes: As highly suspicious as the report might be after 4 or 5 preceding reports already, the doubt remains as to the seriousness of the proposition as it doesn't take into account the perspective of a Shadowdancer using the ability. Nonetheless, I don't believe that I can recall a skill that kills off an entire skillset of a class when it's supposed to supplement their offense either, and as systems have shown already, singular choke seems to be dealt with just fine in one on one combative situations. Until these most base issues are addressed, the report just seems to be some haphazard reaction to some recent group scuffle where the rules of affliction still remain worlds apart in balancing, since any other well-used hinder will inevitably kill the lone target against the group (read: forced off-equilibrium, stuns, pits, crucifies, etc.) ---on 7/12 @ 21:20 writes: "Single target choke in group combat is akin to playing hot potato with a small nuke."? Drop Brumetower, drop Choke, Hartstone is SOL. Drop Choke, kill Geomancer effects. I'm not entirely sure how this is a 'downgrade' myself. And, given that Choke is the Shadowdancer form of aeon, it kind of -needs- to work in combination with their fae somehow. Just like the other ent-classes with their versions of aeon. ---on 7/13 @ 16:29 writes: I don't think the idea is as outlandish as you make it sound. In other IRE games, retardation (choke) makes your passive vibes disappear. What if choke made the ents tick 1.5* slower (there are already bard songs that affect their rate, so this has got to be possible), and demesne effects twice as slow (from a coding perspective, an effect would give you a 'charge' for that effect, then the next time it hit it would do the actual effect. Basically it would tick every other hit). Lord knows active attacks suffer in choke; there should be some restraint on passives I think. ---on 7/13 @ 21:45 writes: I'm guessing you're also going to apply the same slow-down principle to bard songs hitting in choke as well. It's more palatable, but I still don't see the effects of choke dropping on movement, especially since we don't have perfectfifth to keep someone in the effect. ---on 7/14 @ 03:27 writes: We could and it's probably a good idea, though I don't see it as as big of an issue since they need to strip deaf for them to work. The reasoning behind the fade on movement is so you can't drop choke in important rooms (like domothean thrones) and bail. You need to be there to keep your choke active. Furthermore, it ensures you can only choke one room at a time. ---on 7/14 @ 07:28 writes: If demesne ticks are going to slow to half-speed, I'd say just make it half- speed for fae too. Technically, effects of choke used to drop on movement anyway since the target would be out of the choked room with the tumble. Also agree with Fillin above on making sure you can't blanketly choke an area and run for it. Perhaps ought to ensure multiple people can't all choke the same room, too. (It also occurs to me that this might mean druids'll use thornlash more.) ---on 7/14 @ 21:59 writes: Going to need to ensure that elevation change doesn't drop the choke if room change does. Also, 2-3s before the choke drops in a room change isn't enough since moving out to chase and hopefully shove someone back into the choke will take more than 3s. ---on 7/14 @ 23:39 writes: Make it like carcer where you can only have 1 choked room. If yuo choke another your last room choked fades. Also drop the duration of room wide choke to about half. ---on 7/15 @ 07:54 writes: Or what if it stayed as the current targetted casting, and just have it affect everyone in the caster's room until caster/target separation(curing choke) occurs like it does now? That way you could still chase, and making it require a target would help stop camping a prechoked a room with hexes, etc. And if you choke an ally, it makes it easier to drop since there's now two people you can move to try to stop the choke. (Also, with a Shadowdancer's access to Brumetower, what elevation change could possibly be relevant?) ---on 7/15 @ 14:33 writes: That's actually... very clever. I'd support that if it went with the passives mitigation as well. ---on 7/16 @ 03:26 writes: Very interesting, actually, Raeri. I'd like to retain the chasing mechanism, and the song/demesne/ent slowdown wouldn't be bad either. ---on 7/18 @ 16:44 writes: His worded of the problem is wrong and he did not research well what he was discussing. Still, solution 2 does not in anyway require him to have done full research on Temp Insanity, since solution 2 can easily stand on its own by making a simple statement of how it is more inline with how aeonics works, than the present effect of TimeWarp. So I support solution 2 because it makes sense, not because of what of the comparisons made between Temp Insanity and TimeWarp. ---on 7/19 @ 02:09 writes: Bah, hit the wrong number when posting what I have above. Ignore it please ---on 7/19 @ 10:38 writes: Oh, and to reiterate, without a better form of keeping someone in choke, having the room-version drop on caster movement won't work since people like to tumble. At least the current incarnation enables the possibility of good timing to keep it going through tumbles or somersaults, but if chasing were outright removed, the power cost will need to be reviewed.